A Single Mom’s Journey Raising a Child with Autism and the Power of Life Coaching | Ep21

What if the feelings of isolation and loneliness you’ve been grappling with could be the very catalyst for a transformative journey? This week on the Special Parent Podcast, we sit down with Annie Carter, a resilient life coach and single mom, who opens up about her heartfelt experiences of raising a child with autism. From recognizing the early signs in her son, to facing initial resistance from medical professionals, and finally finding effective therapies, Annie’s journey is a testament to patience, unconditional love, and the power of advocacy. Her touching stories of navigating the highs and lows of special needs parenting will resonate deeply with anyone on a similar path.

Ever wondered how a life coach can help you overcome emotional challenges, much like a soccer coach guiding their team? Annie shares invaluable insights into the practical steps life coaching offers, emphasizing the importance of thought work and the role it plays in conquering loneliness and building resilience. We also delve into the distinction between life coaching and therapy, and explore innovative tools like the Marco Polo app that provide real-time support and validation, making the process of managing emotions much more effective. Through Annie’s expertise, listeners will gain a clearer understanding of how to take actionable steps towards a more fulfilling and connected life.

Connecting with others on an emotional level can often feel daunting, especially when grappling with feelings of rejection and self-worth. Annie courageously shares her personal battles with depression, the pain of broken relationships, and the journey to finding self-acceptance. Together, we explore the universal nature of emotions and the power of empathy in fostering deep, meaningful connections. Drawing from her experiences as a special needs parent, Annie discusses the importance of reparenting oneself through their children and teaching them resilience. This episode is a heartfelt exploration of the joys and challenges of parenting, and a reminder of the transformative power of empathy and self-love. Join us for a conversation filled with hope, healing, and the celebration of milestones that make the journey worthwhile.

Chapters

• 0:09 Navigating Isolation in Special Needs Parenting
• 11:15 Navigating Emotions With a Life Coach
• 19:49 Building Self-Worth and Overcoming Loneliness
• 30:59 Connecting Through Emotional Understanding
• 39:29 Navigating Rejection and Self-Acceptance
• 44:25 Parenting With Joy and Healing

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:09

Hi everyone, welcome to the Special Parent Podcast. I'm Dr Deanna Iverson and I'm so glad you're here to join us today. I have a special guest with me here, annie. Would you please introduce yourself?

Speaker 2: 0:18

I would love to. Yeah, I'm Annie and I'm a life coach and a mom of two, and I love what I do because I've struggled myself with feeling lonely. I mean, who hasn't honestly right? But it's been a struggle between being a single mom and being a special needs mom is a double dose of feeling isolated at times and I've learned that there really are ways to figure that out and to not be wallowing in this loneliness. And yeah. So my kiddos are 10 and 11. Oh boy, 18 months apart. What a fun age they are. You know what it is like the best age right now.

Speaker 2: 0:54

I'm loving parenting at the moment not all of it, none of us do but, like for the most part, like we're at a really fun age, like everyone can play uno, everyone wipes their own butt you know like everyone can like sort of like figure out lunch you know right like I can play uno everyone wipes their own butt. You know like everyone can like sort of like figure out lunch. You know right like I can sleep in on saturday because, like, they'll just eat chips and watch youtube and it's fine and that's what saturday mornings are for. It's okay, I mean how many?

Speaker 1: 1:14

times did we get up and just shove cereal in our mouth as we were watching some sort of cartoon we all did it yeah we survived, surviving.

Speaker 2: 1:21

It's totally like they a little self-sufficient sort of you know. So the sweet spot, but they still think I'm funny. Oh, that's nice, we're in a good place.

Speaker 1: 1:29

Yeah, yeah, that's a good one we have an 11-year-old, so we have three, and my youngest is 11, 11, 14, 17. I spread mine out a little bit more because I was so stressed. Yeah yeah, it was all about the plan and the stress and it didn't reduce the stress.

Speaker 2: 1:46

It's just different yeah totally.

Speaker 1: 1:48

I like that, but I love how you mentioned it. There's a level of self-sufficiency that does take some of the stress off being a parent.

Speaker 1: 1:56

And as special needs parents. We know that there are some parents that never get quite that level of self-sufficiency Totally, which can even lead to more feelings of isolated alone. No one understands, I can't go anywhere because of what's going on in my life, because I have someone who's still very infant-like, in some ways, 100%, and so that's a level of stress. So that's why we wanted to talk, right, yes, and we wanted to talk all about how we can kind of overcome that. So first, all you did say you have two, I have two, and one of them does have autism. You said yes, yes, my oldest.

Speaker 2: 2:31

so my sweet little 11 year old. He'll be 12 in january, but for now he's 11 and we say, you know, 11 evan, and uh, yeah, so he is. I guess we're like eight-ish years into our, you know, doing treatment for all the things. He got diagnosed when he was two officially, and then, you know, in Arizona they have you do like the at-risk at first and then they do like the permanent diagnosis at like age six or so and so, but around age three was when we got like real services and started doing all the therapies and all the things and all of that. So, yeah, he is my greatest joy and my greatest teacher. We'll put it that way, right?

Speaker 1: 3:10

I love that, because we do learn so much from our children. Yes, they're teaching us. Well, let's start off with patience.

Speaker 2: 3:18

Oh, so much patience.

Speaker 1: 3:21

The patience there is, but they're also teaching us about a level of love that I don't think we would have ever understood. Oh yeah, and a level of forgiveness for, sometimes, the other people in the world who aren't responding in a way that is conducive to raising a special needs child. So I know that, and again, we're talking about isolation and being alone, and that can definitely key right in on that. Yeah, totally for sure. So, all right, seven, 11, 11. Going to be 12.

Speaker 2: 3:49

You're going to have to come with me, right? I know I've got to come with a new thing but for now it's working.

Speaker 1: 3:54

So you said kind of right in the early stages you knew that your child was a little unique.

Speaker 2: 4:01

Yes, well, his dad at first was definitely the one that was like I think he has autism at age one. I was like, well, I don't know. I mean we're first time parents, what do we know? And I mean I'm breastfeeding, so I'm getting eye contact from him, so it's like a different. What's the word? It's a. Is that over?

Speaker 2: 4:18

Like a connection that was different. It's just like a different, yeah, like a different connection, a different, you know experience than dad was having. Oh, yeah, right, not that dad's experience was wrong, it was just different than mine, right. And so at first I was like oh, maybe I don't know, and kind of dropped it. And then 18 months dad came back again, Like I really think he has it, he has a cousin with autism. He's like I'm pretty, some research online was just, you know, worried about it. So I took like the m chat online and it said he was high risk. Like okay, so went to the pediatrician and at first she dismissed me. Well, lots of kids don't talk to their two. I was like I gave you like seven other things, right besides not talking to one of them.

Speaker 2: 4:57

Okay, yeah, and you didn't hear on any of those things, which was kind of my first step in becoming my kid's voice. Yes, you know which, I'm sure anybody listening you are your own kid's voice, right? That's what we have to do as special needs parents. We have to be the advocate, right we do. And I remember being like, excuse me, you know, and that fired me up and I've been shouting loud and proud for him ever since then. But it took six months for them to finally say, oh yeah, you should go to a developmental ped, you know. And then they did the, you know, at risk diagnosis and did early intervention, which was sorry, I think a joke in Arizona. I think it's not helpful. It did not help us. It's made me feel more alone than ever. Age two to three was probably when I felt more alone than ever in my life, and not until we got some like therapist, because they're like, okay, here's this therapist for you, they're going to tell you what to do. Like, do you think I have a master's degree in occupational therapy?

Speaker 1: 5:51

I do not Right and telling you what to do if then they send you home, no one's, in a sense, watching you to see. Am I doing it right? Is it being effective?

Speaker 2: 6:06

I'm like like I don't know what I'm doing. I did this, but did it work right? Valid point, and they handed me this list of like 30 to 50 like activities I could try for sensory stuff. That's a lot, I'm all well. Where does one start?

Speaker 2: 6:16

and how long am I doing said item on this list to know if it's being effective, right, right, we did like the sensory brushing and like the, you know, walking on certain objects or whatever, like we tried all these things I'm like, but I don't know. So I started. I had to start getting really clear my own intuition, like okay, friend is putting rocks in his mouth, there we go, we got some sensory things going on, right, I mean, I knew that anyway, because the homie had a passy from like day one and was not letting it go. But also he'd walk on rocks on purpose. Oh, interesting, like, oh, okay, so get him some feet.

Speaker 1: 6:48

input or whatever right.

Speaker 2: 6:50

But their guidance was not helpful. I'm sure they meant well and I'm sure they're doing the very best they knew how to do, but left mama feeling really alone.

Speaker 1: 6:59

In one of my episodes I do talk about how to be a partner with your doctors, and it's so true because they can give you a lot of really great advice and they really usually are really well-meaning from the heart. They want the best for you and your child, Sure, but they don't live it Right and so they hand you what was it? 30?

Speaker 2: 7:19

things. Well, this was like the the arizona intervention, early intervention, oh my gosh yeah that's in the doctor it was. They're like here's a list of sensory stuff. I'm like what am I doing with this friggin list?

Speaker 1: 7:31

like what do you want for me? Right, and that's so overwhelming. It actually added more stress than how much more stress like?

Speaker 2: 7:37

are you serious right now?

Speaker 2: 7:38

so then when he started like actual therapy, where I'd bring it to them and say, okay, here's my kid, right, and they're like, okay, and they figured out right, they'd work through the stuff. So then we started seeing some more progress. He started aba therapy and occupational and speech and he did physical for like a hot minute, just music therapy, like we did so many therapies. I mean, the kid was so over there by, I think in the beginning. Yes, know, like preschool and all the things, and we're going to cure you, you know, oh yeah.

Speaker 1: 8:06

My husband once said oh wait, that doesn't work. Yeah, there's no cure actually. No, actually that's not a thing. Surprise, my husband actually one time said I can't wait for the weekend. So it's funny how you can have people around you all the time and feel lonely 100.

Speaker 2: 8:23

Especially when you feel like you're under a microscope. Yeah, that's how I feel. Everyone's watching what you're doing. Yeah, everyone's like micromanaging my parenting and if I do anything wrong, it's like I've got 17 humans to account to for my parenting and this is my first time.

Speaker 1: 8:46

And I don't know what I'm doing, right? Well, even if it was your fifth time with a special needs kid, everything's going to be different. And even with children that we like to call neurotypical, every child is different. Every child is going to respond to feedback in a different way, to discipline, to positive feedback, all of that, and then you put in special needs. I mean, parenting is exhausting enough on its own. And now here we add this where, like you said, there's so many people around all the time who are actually analyzing your parenting. Yeah, and it's not fun. Yeah, not fun at all. It's not just like you have friends around hanging out.

Speaker 2: 9:17

No, these people are. They're taking notes, they're taking data on the things you're doing when you're a child and you're like, listen, I'm doing the best, I know how to do. Can you put that in your notes? Put that in your notes, please bless. It was terrible and later on over the years I got used to having someone over all the time, but it was definitely an adjustment. I mean, for those. I mean everyone listening for the most part is going to be a special needs parent, probably get that.

Speaker 2: 9:39

But maybe the friends you hang out with don't quite understand that right, and that can feel a little isolating too. Sometimes when you have experiences they can't quite understand. We can dive into that a bit more with, like, how to overcome that, but but that can feel isolating. When you feel like you have an experience, they don't know what it's like because someone in your house all the time yeah, and you have to get used to it, but it's not a cleaner, it's not a maid, it's not a nanny yeah, it's someone who's analyzing things, yep and so, and then you get together with your friends and you're venting, because that's kind of what friendship time is for a lot of times right we've got it.

Speaker 1: 10:12

we've got to let some stress out, and everybody does that, and then good willing, good meaning, friends and families go well, have you, have you tried? Yeah, and you're like mm-hmm. And so now you feel like you're justifying or defending yourself. And they don't mean it that way, but that's how it kind of impacts you.

Speaker 1: 10:31

It's like, oh, I have to justify and defend this, Right, that's a really good point. And even if you're like, no, we haven't tried it, but there's a reason, right, haven't tried it, but there's a reason, you know, right, caveat a, b, c and d yeah, right, totally. So, yeah, no, I hear what you're saying on that one. Um, so we've kind of talked a little bit about that. You said you're a life coach. Can you please explain what is a life coach? So many people have heard about it what does that mean?

Speaker 2: 10:56

yeah, totally in fact. I met someone recently, like in a networking thing, like I had my life. I'm like I'm a life coach and they're like what's that? I'm like I just assume by now most people have heard of it, but I'm still surprised there are so many people that don't know. Which is fine. I just live in my little bubble of like coaching world and so I think that everyone knows.

Speaker 2: 11:15

I think the best way to describe a life coach is think of like a soccer coach. They are seeing what you're doing and saying, hey, here's some ideas, here's some suggestions to improve your skillset. Yeah, we may not be diving super deep into like all the things you did before soccer practice. Right, we're saying here at this practice, right now, I'm observing the actions you're taking in the soccer game and saying, hey, if you want to improve making a goal, maybe try this. If you want to improve your kicking, you're going to try this. So when you're with a life coach, you're saying, hey, here's a specific problem. Most, every coach has not all, but most of them have a specific area or pain point they're going to help you with.

Speaker 2: 11:58

So for me that's like overcoming loneliness is kind of the overarching theme of what I work with people on Because you have experience, lots of it, and, which is funny, because people are like you get lonely because I'm so spastic and out there and aggressively friendly, you know. But that doesn't mean I don't feel lonely and have not battled that right, but maybe it's like physical, physical health or, you know, there might be some other. Whatever the area is, essentially, your coach is there to be your coach to say, hey, here's where we're at right now. So for me, I'm saying, okay, where are we at right now with our support system? Where are we at? And feeling lonely? Okay, where would you like to be?

Speaker 2: 12:37

And then I'm going to talk with you about all the thoughts, because life coaching is a lot about thought work. There's definitely like other modalities and different things you can do, but that's essentially the main part of it is looking at what thoughts you have. So let's work on how are you approaching this loneliness right now? Yes, and what are you doing about it right now? And I'm a safe space to say, sister, I got got you and let's figure out how to get from here to here. Yes, you want to feel less lonely, you want to feel seen and supported. You can totally get there. I will help you. I'm going to hold your hand and give you guidance on how to get to that space. Please go to therapy still, like I love therapy.

Speaker 1: 13:15

I love that. You know that's a great way to talk about the difference between a counselor and a life coach. The counselor is going to go back and talk about what happened four or five games ago and is going to dive into some deeper issues. The life coach is going to say this is where we're at here, this is where we want to go talk about steps.

Speaker 2: 13:32

Totally, and I think you should. I recommend always, even if you're working with a coach, with me or whoever, to still be diving into those other things and because the therapist can also talk about now or whatever, and kind of link those patterns, things like that. Like having that safe space, I think is still very important. I'd like to think of it also as like I'm like a mentor and accountability coach, like I'm here to kind of just be that space to check in with you, of like how we doing right, doing okay. You know, in fact I'm actually offering like marco polo support coaching so they can just marco when they're like having a moment.

Speaker 2: 14:05

Yeah, like hey in fact, so far, my clients love that they can just do that when they are mad, because if you sit down for a session they're like oh well, four days ago I was really mad. I remember all the details about it?

Speaker 1: 14:16

what was I mad?

Speaker 2: 14:16

about something with my kid, I don't know. Right life, right, life happened, yes. But when you're in the moment you're like I'm just like raw, let it out, yes, right. And then within like 24 to 48 hours, I'm like, hey, sister, I got you, yeah. Yeah. That's really hard because we all want to get seen in our pain. That's so true.

Speaker 1: 14:33

We all do Right experiencing, whatever it was, all the things, the anger, the hurt, whatever we want to know, it's okay that we experience it, not that we should stay experiencing it. Sure, that's exhausting, right? Oh gosh, this moment was okay. So, marco polo, I never thought about that app.

Speaker 2: 14:52

That is a great resource I've actually been telling other coaches like, start using marco polo. It's such an amazing resource to be able to or you can use, use Voxer or other modalities, right? I just happen to love Marco Polo in my own life. I use it all the time and it helps me feel less lonely because I can be connected to people. Even if our schedules don't line up, even if our phases of life don't line up whatever, I could still just hop on and, hey, friend, here's my date today, right. And then whenever they have a minute minute, they can get back right.

Speaker 1: 15:20

It's like a walkie talkie well, and I I would say for life coaching, you probably can review with them. Okay, this is how you felt four days ago, like you said, totally like I'm taking notes anyway, but yeah, but they can even go back.

Speaker 2: 15:31

And what they like about my end of the marco polo is that I'll give them things to think about, like hey, I, I see you, like I'm, I'm here with you and I see you, and that is so painful and I can understand why that's painful. Like that, just really deep validation. And then also what do we want to do with this? And I give them some questions like what do you think about this? Or you know, what does that word mean to you? Can you define that for me? Like kind of those you know deeper questions to kind of get them thinking so we can pull ourselves out of that space. Right, and what's great for my clients is that they can go back and listen to that.

Speaker 2: 16:05

Like my first my first I was a friend of mine who's so amazing like let me pilot this and try it out, and I asked her feedback. She was like my favorite part is that when I forget, what did Annie say, I'll go back. I can go back. She's like, oh, yeah, she told me to do this, this, this and this got it right. Yeah, and it's great. She's like, oh, this is, my assignment was to do this and this.

Speaker 2: 16:27

And we're not talking crazy assignments, right. We're moms right. Right, like what time you got for assignments? I just mean, like take three to five minutes to journal about this thing, like what was coming up for you with this and what pattern are you seeing there and what does this remind you of? And you know things like that to kind of get to. We're going to get a little bit deeper stuff. It's not like we're not ignoring the past, right. We're just saying hey, did that remind you something from the past? Cool, is it happening now? Like just kind of getting clear on those things and so, and that's really helpful yeah, that loneliness can relate to anxiety about future situations and everything else.

Speaker 1: 16:56

So being able to go back to your messages, what a great opportunity to say I need a quick reminder before I step into a situation where I was lonely before and now I'm anxious about it and all this, and or I'm feeling lonely again. I can go back to this message. I mean, what a great opportunity for you to technically reach out to your clients more frequently than you have to reach out to your clients. They have you on demand. Right, I can pull back up what she told me three days ago, three weeks ago.

Speaker 2: 17:26

That is so amazing. They do have this option to just like pop in whenever they need to, right, and then I and I will even check in like hey, just thinking about you. You know, you've got this today, like I'll give you pep talks if you need, like what is it you need for your support and get you to a space where, hopefully, eventually, you don't need me.

Speaker 1: 17:43

Right, you know. As you said, it's training our thoughts to be different which helps every area of our life.

Speaker 1: 17:50

If we can train ourselves to control our thoughts, which then loop right into our emotions and behaviors. We're going to train ourselves for more success, deeper and more meaningful relationships, more stable relationships and professional, personal, all those kinds of things. Yes, I love that. So, reframing our thoughts, I love that and I talk to when I work with the students that I work with and when I even talk on the podcast about, sometimes, emotions. I'm like we have to remember our emotions are coming from a different part of our brain, Yep, and so if we can bring ourselves out of that part of our brain and we can think about it, then we're not making an emotional decision which then is going to lead us down the road we don't want to be down 100%.

Speaker 2: 18:30

It's a beautiful way of saying it. I also like to say that when we're back in that other part of our brain, there's no logical thinking happening. So when we acknowledge and validate and see that pain, it goes way faster and we move through it a little quicker, yes, and then we can come back to the problem solving. Nobody's problem solving when they're emotional Never.

Speaker 1: 18:48

None of us are, or they're reacting, which later on they realize wasn't the solution.

Speaker 2: 18:53

Right, they think they might be problem solving. But no good, maybe I should say no good, problem solving is happening when you are an emotional brain.

Speaker 1: 19:00

That's true, that emotional brain likes to come up with very creative solutions.

Speaker 1: 19:09

Sometimes like key cars and yeah, all the things, and not always the best solution, not a great solution, yeah, so one of the things we talked about was special needs moms. We can feel isolated or alone. So how do you, as a special needs mom you said you've, you've walked this walk how did you find, first of all, find the power and the strength to overcome it? And then what? What did you do to get through it? So we'll start with how did you find that power and strength to to do this walk?

Speaker 2: 19:32

That's a really good way of phrasing it the power and strength to walk this walk. And before even answering that, I guess I just I want to speak to anyone listening right now who's like well, sounds easy for you because you're really outgoing, you know. Here's the thing wherever you're at, I just want you to know that I see you. This is so painful, it is Like I do not want to minimize in any way, shape or form how painful it is to feel really alone, even if you have a family, even if you're in a room full of people. That lonely feeling is crippling at times, you know, and it is so, so painful, and so I don't want to ever minimize that and and so, yeah, so finding the power and the strength to overcome that loneliness, I think was born from a place of. I can't do this anymore Because I have always been I shouldn't say always.

Speaker 2: 20:22

I was pretty shy when I was younger with people outside my family, but from probably like 10 to 12 on, I've been pretty loud and bombastic, like I just have always been aggressively friendly and just been out there. So people don't think that I'm lonely and people never imagined that I was depressed and I attempted suicide at 21, and so I'm well, actually 20. I'm 41 now, and that started my journey, though, of like overcoming I don't like how I talk to myself, this is a problem and so I mean it's taken many, many years. I started my mental health journey at that point. Okay, enough is enough. This is clearly not working right. Because I thought my world had ended it because my fiance had cheated on me and I was never going to be lovable.

Speaker 2: 21:06

That was the belief that I was hanging on to with every fiber was like I am not lovable, and when I lived in that so deeply that I'm not lovable, the last thing I wanted to live in was my head anymore, right, and I was like, nope, I want out. It wasn't necessarily that I wanted to die, it was that I wanted that pain to stop. So I think we have to have compassion as well for those who've attempted or succeeded in suicide, because it's it's so painful. They just want the pain to stop, right, and so that started the okay. Things got to change a little bit, yeah, but my real like transformation really happened after my second divorce. Okay, so I have my two kiddos are with my second husband, and it was a rough marriage. We don't speak names or details out of respect, for that's my father's, you know my kid's father.

Speaker 2: 21:57

Yeah, yeah, but I got you, but really painful, really painful, isolating marriage. And I remember, after that second divorce, laying face down on the floor just like bawling my eyes out, like here I am again and now I've got kids. I've done a lot of work and I'm very proud of myself. I have picked myself up time after time again when I felt depressed, I felt anxious, felt alone, put on a happy face for everybody else, and especially your kids and my children bless their hearts. And and I was like, okay, something has to give, because one on the common denominator. What's going on here? Not because I'm a bad person, but there's something happening here that I'm attracting the same type of guy. Why and it hit me so hard, it's because that's what you think you deserve oh yeah, I don't deserve anything better.

Speaker 2: 22:46

Why am I going to look for anything better? Right and I'm tolerating things that are not okay, and my husband's also tolerated things from me that they probably shouldn't have. I definitely had my part to play in my marriages not working right. Nobody's perfect. We all contribute to problems right, don't we all?

Speaker 2: 23:02

contribute and I I didn't. I thought I had done so well, like being confident, but when I really realized that the true root of that is, I needed to find myself worth, that my worth does not change. And in the book, worthy, I think it's jamie lena. What's her name? We'll look it up, we'll look it up.

Speaker 1: 23:21

I'll put it on my website for you guys. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 23:22

I love it. But the book's called Worthy and I love her definition of self-worth. Is your foundation, that's your rock solid foundation. It never changes, right. Your worth never changes. Your confidence is the house you build on the foundation. Oh, so I think it's such a cool way to put it. It's a great visual, right, and we do have certain confidence in certain areas, like I'm really confident in some of my talents and abilities, but maybe in other areas I'm not as confident, right. So we're constantly building and maybe it gets torn down by experiences. They build it back up, so it's a constant construction process on this house on top of our foundation, and so I had to then go back to okay, I needed to do the work on my self-worth. I've been trying to build my confidence, but I had no foundation.

Speaker 2: 24:08

I had to get back to. Okay, if I don't like me, then how am I attracting anybody who likes me? And not that I didn't have great friends. I definitely did, I still do. I have friends from 20 plus years that I adore. But if I'm looking to stop feeling lonely, I have to feel at home in my own body. And how do you do that? Well, you have to change the narrative in your head.

Speaker 1: 24:32

I love that You've talked so much about that, that narrative, the way we talk to ourselves about ourselves, our circumstances, our world, everything. And if we find ourselves caught in the loop of speaking negative about who we are, about who we are in our roles of life, but about who we are just as, like you said, that foundation, who am I, then we are, we're setting ourselves up for that loneliness which, in a sense, is a toxicity that's going to spread to our children. Yeah, because they're going to learn that pattern of behavior even though we don't think we're teaching it.

Speaker 2: 25:06

Oh, they're doing anything we do, yes, please bless. When I hear my daughter playing with her Barbies and she sounds exactly like me, you know I'm like oh okay, but sometimes it's cute, like she'll say put your seatbelt on, I love you too much to see you what I say. So good, sometimes it's good things. So they hear the good and the bad.

Speaker 1: 25:24

All the things in between? Yeah, for sure. So yeah, talking about changing the narrative in your head, and that takes practice.

Speaker 2: 25:31

So much practice.

Speaker 1: 25:32

Which is what, like you said, life coaching is all about coaching you to change that narrative. You're going to say okay, you're going to send me a Marco, right? So they send you a Marco and they say these are the thoughts in my head right now I'm really mad or I'm really hurt, or whatever the emotions are. These are the thoughts, this is the narrative. And then you can get back to them and say hey, I hear you, I can understand why you're feeling that way. So let's talk about how we change our narrative so we can stop feeling that way.

Speaker 2: 25:58

Right, and maybe you'll always feel that way, essentially, sometimes right like I. I'm 20 years into this practice and I'm not perfect by any stretch. I even had a meltdown yesterday. You know, like we're still gonna have experiences, life is still gonna happen, but our resiliency with those things does change when we learn how to talk to ourselves differently.

Speaker 2: 26:20

Right, and I can be alone. I mean, I'm a single parent, meaning there are half the time I'm totally alone in my house. It's just me, and that was a big adjustment from I grew up in a big family. There are six kids in my family and when I was married, obviously I was never alone. You know it's had its own set of problems, right, but but then it was like, oh, I have to actually face, like being alone and missing my kids and wishing I could be with them and just facing all of that, and so that's one piece of it is when you can learn to really genuinely love yourself and I'm talking like mad hearts above the eye crush on yourself. You know what I'm saying. You were like I love her so much. We are not talking about cockiness. We're not talking about cockiness. We're not talking about better than Right. I don't think I'm better than anybody, right, but do I like me? Heck, yeah, I do Right.

Speaker 1: 27:10

I'm pretty awesome and you still know you have weaknesses and challenges 100%. And you still know that you're not perfect.

Speaker 2: 27:18

No, I have many things that I need support in, like when I do my kindness camp in the summer for girls. I talk about strengths and supports. We all have strengths and then things we need support in. Even calling it a weakness sometimes can give the feeling of lesser than you know or powerless. You know and not that it's meant to be that way but it can feel more empowering to say these are things I need support in. You know, I am a fun person to be around, but no one's asking me to do their taxes. You know what I'm saying. Nor would they ever Would they ask for directions from me. No, they would not. But they want to talk to me because I'm fun to talk to. We all have things that we're good at and things that we're not.

Speaker 1: 27:58

That we're not good at, yeah, and that I'm, but I'm done beating myself up for things I'm not good at, and that's why you want to help people create a community, because we as humans humans are intended to be in community with others, so we're intended to have our strengths and have our areas that we don't have strengths, and the point of that is that we can build each other up, that we're not meant to truly be alone, though there are times we should learn to be confident in our loneliness. Yeah, and because that's not our state of being. It's just a moment, Totally.

Speaker 1: 28:30

And so overcoming that. You know I love when you talked about you had to learn to truly be alone, because it was silent in your house. Kids were gone.

Speaker 2: 28:40

It was silent, weird, weird silence.

Speaker 1: 28:41

Yet probably 50% of the listeners would go. Can I get that?

Speaker 2: 28:46

I know, because, listen, it sounds really cute until you have it. Until you have it, because, like, listen, the first two weekends you'd be like heck, yeah, right. And then after five years you're like, oh well, can they just come back now? Yeah, I just miss them and I just want to hang out with them. And things are actually better with my ex and I and we actually have been doing more like I've been watching them when he's at work and, you know, helping each other out and so more of a team effort.

Speaker 2: 29:10

Now, yeah, there's, there's more chances for me to see them, like on my not kid time, you know, like even Monday and Tuesday this week not my kid week, but I had him after school at my house to just hang out till dad came, and you, you know. So we definitely have more cohesiveness there. But there's still like today I'm going to go home and my house will be empty, you know. And I think we have to differentiate between being alone and then feeling lonely. Yes, Because I can be all by myself and if I'm in a really good headspace, I don't feel lonely, right, I'm just chilling myself. You know what I mean. But you can, like you said before, you can be with people and feel lonely and feel lonely Right. So it's this.

Speaker 1: 29:47

It's what's happening up here, it's that headspace Totally. It's that narrative that we tell ourselves, yeah, so, all right. So what were some of the narratives you had to flip to help yourself get through this Such a good question?

Speaker 2: 30:00

Okay. So one thing I thought about and I love these questions you have and I was thinking about yeah, like, what are some like actionable things right? And the first thought that came to my mind immediately was when we say that no one understands us right, and I think that that's pretty common in the special needs world Because, yes, we have friends around us and family members around us that don't understand what our experience is, but the thought of no one understands me or what I'm going through is so isolating it is, so the thought is more isolating than the reality.

Speaker 2: 30:34

100%, because when you're thinking, oh yeah, no one understands me. No one understands me. You are creating isolation in your own mind and you are disconnecting yourself from other people. Here's the magic sauce. You ready, I'm ready. You probably already know this, but the magic sauce is our experiences will never be the same. Right? We're both special needs parents. Our experiences are different. They are Right, and I respect yours and I'm going to learn from yours and honor what you have to bring to the table. Because of your experiences, and we've probably had similar feelings. Yes, because of your experiences, and we've probably had similar feelings.

Speaker 2: 31:05

Yes, our connecting piece is the feeling we felt lonely. I don't think I've met a single human being who hasn't felt lonely. We've all felt sad. We've all felt angry, nervous, disappointed. There's only so many feelings to have. Yeah, that's true, right, you can have caveats like frustrated, irritated but there's only so many feelings you're actually going to have. So that is where we find common ground, that's where we get connected. We can say, hey, tell me about your experience. And they'll hear that and say, oh man, I hear that so hard and you validate them and you're like man, I bet you felt really fill in the blank. You felt really angry when that doctor didn't listen to you. Yes, man, really fill in the blank. They felt really angry when that doctor didn't listen to you. Yes, man, I can totally relate to feeling angry about not being listened to, right?

Speaker 1: 31:52

It's super sucks, and I feel that for you, right. When you told your story, that was exactly one of the thoughts that went through my mind was oh my gosh. I remember that time when I could completely just connect with the feeling of how it would be to experience that again. Yeah, and then it also did help me think how did I get through it, right?

Speaker 2: 32:09

yeah, totally, because we, like I have a um there's a story about, there's a woman that I she's happily married, 20 some years, you know love her so much. We have roommates at a retreat and I had this trigger come up around. It's gonna be the first time I was gonna meet my ex's girlfriend and it wasn't about her, it just was all this pain of like he's moved on, he doesn't care about me anymore. Just all this pain came up and I started bawling my face off and I was so embarrassed and she's like, oh honey, I got you and just like rubbed my back and let me get it out. And she's like, yeah, I bet that's really painful. And she just validated my feelings.

Speaker 2: 32:44

She did not have to experience what I experienced again, happily married, she's not dealing with what I'm dealing with, right. And she felt seen by her because she was like, yeah, I bet that's really scary and she could relate to the scary. She could relate to the fears. Not, you know, meeting my kid's stepmom, right, that was not a thing. We're all all happy now, all is well, right, but this was years ago and it just was a powerful lesson for me in we do not have to stay in the same experiences to connect.

Speaker 1: 33:10

So finding a way to connect with other people regardless of experiences, more on that emotional level of, I can just understand your emotional pain, I can just understand your emotional center, yeah, and I can help you walk through the emotional part of this.

Speaker 2: 33:25

Yes, totally, because again, that thought sorry, a little microphone, I'm just smacking you and it's not even your fault the thought itself no one understands me is going to create isolation. Right, the thought of my experiences are my experiences and I can connect other people on emotions will feel connecting, right. So it's just the tweak in the wording. Yeah, they don't get what it's like to have the doctor tell you you're crazy, right? You know they don't know what it's like to have your 11 year old have a full-blown meltdown in the bookstore and have some lady come up and say you're too cute to be getting so mad like that. Like you think he cares one iota about what you think he's cute. You know he don't care what you think about him. Yeah, he does not care. You think he's cute? So no, and I just said he has autism. But thank you so much.

Speaker 2: 34:16

And then I went back to him. You know, because I have just spent a lot of time sitting with him in it. I want people to do that for me. I want people to sit with me in my pain, right? So, even if that's super embarrassing in the middle of this bookstore, yes, to be like hey, bud, and I sit down on the floor with him. I'm like, hey, buddy, I hear you want that book so bad and you are so mad. I hear you and I love you anyway. I love you when you're mad, yep, and just sat with him and he was screaming his face off. Do you think that I let that deter me? No, this lady deter me. Heck. No Right, because I am committed to being with my kid in his moment of pain. And then eventually we talked him through. He calmed it down. We went to the other bookstore and got the book, like all was well, you know. But in that moment I was like I don't care what anybody people think, I'm just going to be here for him.

Speaker 1: 35:04

And that is so hard, because that is what leads to loneliness too is worrying about what all the other thoughts are, that are out there. I read a blog and I actually did a little quick blurb about it, and it was called Lady, Get Control of your Kid. Oh boy, yes.

Speaker 1: 35:26

And it was written as this is a letter to the guy in the store in the supermarket or something like that, and it talked about how it can be so isolating as a parent whose kid is having a meltdown or having an inappropriate behavior of some sort, or maybe it's actually not even verbal at all, but the child is completely drawing within and you know you have to do something about it. Sensory overload, whatever it is, even again, that neurotypical child, even that neurotypical child, can experience these kinds of situations and when it happens, a lot of times as parents we get distracted by worrying about other people's thoughts Totally, which takes us away from being in the moment with our child.

Speaker 2: 36:07

Yes, that's a beautiful point and so understandable, right. I totally get why we all do that. I still do it sometimes. Yes, it's understandable because, like you said, we're connection creatures. We want to be not kicked out of the herd, right, so we don't want to be too weird and whatever, and so it's totally understandable. But it's that practice of like hey, because when I'm sitting in that moment with him, I have trained myself for the most part, train myself to say they're gonna think I'm weird and that's okay yep, that's okay, I like me and I like my son and I'm gonna send them all love and light, yeah, and it's gonna be fine.

Speaker 2: 36:44

that doesn't mean I don't get frustrated sometimes. I remember many years ago a lady was like attacking me in Chick-fil-A and I stormed out crying and sat in the car just like bawling my face off and my sweet sister-in-law we still consider us family. We don't say farmer, but the in-laws they are so sweet, I love them.

Speaker 2: 37:03

But you know so sister-in-law came out with my chick-fil-a and just like, let me get it out. You know, bless her heart and her kids, not special needs. Yeah, and she could totally be there for me in that moment. I did not handle it well back in the day, so I've definitely had to grow into the space of right now. What do I care more about? I mean, yes, I care that they're. I'm never gonna say I don't care at all, right, I think that's unrealistic right.

Speaker 2: 37:26

But I care more about my goal of being here for my son, and they can be wrong about me, right?

Speaker 1: 37:33

that's another thought I love that they can be wrong. That's cool, and you can just let them have that.

Speaker 2: 37:40

Yeah, we don't have to change their opinion. No, but that comes back to like when I get very clear in my value, then I know that that's their opinion's wrong. But when I think that there's something wrong with me, that's where the real pain comes. That's the problem. The barb is in the little hook. Is the what we?

Speaker 1: 37:59

believe if we adopt their perception of us, then we're the one that suffers. Yes, that's perfect. So what we have to do I love that, barb that barb, it sticks in there.

Speaker 2: 38:10

you know, that was so good.

Speaker 1: 38:12

If we adopt someone else's perception, we will feel the pain, Not them us.

Speaker 2: 38:17

Right and we believe it yeah.

Speaker 1: 38:19

So we have to choose not to believe it, right, which?

Speaker 2: 38:22

is not. We're not saying that's easy. No, we have to choose not to believe it Right, which is not. We're not saying that's easy.

Speaker 1: 38:25

No, it's not easy, but it's possible, sometimes going to still come up even when you know you don't believe it. It's almost like the devil on the shoulder. Yep, who's just like hey. Remember that thought you had and you have to again, even though it's three years later or however long later, you have to again go. No, no, no, no.

Speaker 2: 38:42

No, thank you. You're not welcome here, exactly Not today. Not today.

Speaker 1: 38:46

Thank you. So how do you coach parents who are rejected or feel rejected because of their children, in a sense? How do you coach them to cope with that rejection?

Speaker 2: 39:02

That's a beautiful question. I would say that it's going back to taking a deep look at are you rejecting you? Okay, because if that person rejects you, are they for you? Oh, yes, I see what you're saying, are they? Because there's going to be people in our life that don't like us. Yes, that's hard to accept. It is so hard to accept Because we're like how could you not love me?

Speaker 2: 39:29

No, like, look at cute, like, why wouldn't you love me, right? In fact, one of my favorite jokes, like when I speak on stage and stuff I talk about, like y'all may love me, but I got two ex-husbands who disagree with you, right? So you're right. And I think about it this way too like, imagine, like any celebrity, can you tell me one that everybody likes? No, I'll wait. Yeah, exactly, you cannot. There's not a single person on earth that everybody likes.

Speaker 2: 39:51

So, the sooner we can come to peace in terms with that rejection, that it doesn't mean you're not lovable, because that's the barb, right? Yes, if they reject me, there's something wrong with me, got it? If I know, there's nothing wrong with me, I'm just not someone's flavor of snack pack, yeah, you know. Then all right, it's gonna be okay. But if I like my flavor and I'm good with my flavor, it doesn't mean it's not going to hurt when someone says I don't want to be around you or I don't be friends with you. But it's a pain on a different level when you make it about you. I love that, right. When you're like oh, there's something flawed me, that's why they don't want to be around me. I'm the worst and we get in these negative spirals, right. You just go down and down and down into a deep black hole. Trust me, I've been in many of those deep black holes and I've gotten better at catching at the top Like, oh yep, we're going down this road again.

Speaker 1: 40:44

I know that road identifying when you're at the beginning of that spiral, or even the middle. Let's catch it, just identifying it sure catch it at the end.

Speaker 2: 40:52

If you got it like it, just at one point be like oh man, this is not working, because if someone doesn't want to be around me, that's their problem. Right, right, and I and again, and maybe if it's family, that's gonna be a lot harder and stickier it is gonna be for sure, and there maybe, needs to be some like conflict resolution there, maybe some communication coaching going on, you know.

Speaker 2: 41:14

But I think at the end of the day, if you accept you and you know your value, their perception does not define your value, right? I'm actually practicing a lot with dating apps right now. Oh interesting, every time things don't work out, I'm like practicing, like painting on my head, like their perception of you does not define your value, right. Right, because rejection is also part of life. It is a part of life and it's so hard to to watch our kids get rejected and they do.

Speaker 1: 41:40

They do constantly and it almost hurts more than when we are, because I'm just like when my child gets rejected, I actually react way more strongly, yeah, than when I'm rejected. You and that mike are having a special relationship.

Speaker 2: 41:54

It's fine I just love you. It's fine. That is true, because our kids are like our heart outside of our body. Yes, so you feel so vulnerable, like when they're hurting. We're like, no, because our it's painful. It really is, and that's probably a whole other conversation too. But but just again, knowing that they don't want to be around your child, that's a reflection of where they're at. Where they're at and I'm not even saying it's reflection Like they're a bad person, right? I don't believe in bad people, right. I think that that's just where they're at right now, that they can't be in an accepting place Right.

Speaker 1: 42:25

They can't be in an accepting place. They can't understand how to make this work. Hopefully they grow through that.

Speaker 2: 42:32

Yeah, we all hope that for them.

Speaker 1: 42:39

Just like we're trying to grow through that feeling of not allowing that barb to just grab a hold of us and to keep ourselves from doing the spiral all the way down, we're growing. And so we hope that other people are growing at the same time that we're growing through all of those things and hopefully my experience with them, crossing paths with me, helps them on that journey.

Speaker 2: 42:57

In the meantime, it sounds like you're not part of my path, right?

Speaker 1: 42:59

If you don't want to be around me, you're not, I'm not part of your path, and that's okay, and it doesn't mean you're rejecting them because maybe they're going to join your path later. Sure, if you know they might come circle back around, especially, like you said, family, it might be something where you have to learn some skills and then come back together later so they might join your path later. But right now, if that's not where they're supposed to be, you have to, you really have to focus on identifying who you are. Yes, I love that, identifying who you are, finding strength in that. So, if our listeners want to connect with you, what are some of the ways and I'll put everything on the website.

Speaker 2: 43:35

everybody. What are some of the ways that they can connect with you? Perfect, so my website is Annie joycom and then Instagram is Annie joyspeaks, and that's with an.

Speaker 1: 43:40

IE correct.

Speaker 2: 43:40

Yes, a N N I E J O Y. Joy is my middle name, so that's helpful.

Speaker 1: 43:45

I love it. It's very fun. I think that there was a little premonition when they put Joy in the middle name there.

Speaker 2: 43:50

You know it's so funny because it's a generational name. My grandma was Joy, my mom, her middle name is Joy, my middle name is Joy. And then my daughter, her middle name is Joy. And what's funny is that I wouldn't say the previous owners of the name have been so joyful Because of their own pain, right, and their pain and their lack of skills and knowledge, right. I believe that both of them did the very best what they could and are still doing the best they can, right. But I feel like I am a chain breaker in what joy really looks like. And now getting to see daughter, yes, speak up for herself and love herself at age of 10, that's amazing.

Speaker 2: 44:33

she's not perfect, she's 10 when none of us ever get to be perfect no, but people, when they meet her, will tell me, like you named her, well, she's charlotte joy, and she's such a joyful person and she's such a light and it's so healing for me because, yeah, I love my son in a very different special way, right like when you have your special needs kiddos.

Speaker 2: 44:48

It's so healing for me because I love my son in a very different, special way, right like when you have your special needs kiddos. It's different, right, it's different. And her, it's this different connection of I get to like, reparent me through her and I get to parent her the way that I wish I was treated. Yes, and treat her big feelings like they're, you know, something, to be acknowledged and honored and and to be able to teach the things that I didn't know until I was in my 30s and teach her now and to see her like, thrive and grow in this confidence in herself and how she treats other people and how accepting and loving she is. So it's fun because the name has been a generational thing and she has become this embodiment of the word joy. It's amazing she's a chain breaker.

Speaker 1: 45:32

I love that song.

Speaker 2: 45:33

It is a song out there, by the way. You can look it up.

Speaker 1: 45:35

I love that song, chain Breaker, and so the fact that you identify yourself as one and you've seen, you've seen the efforts that you have made, you've seen the fruits of your labor, yeah, so that's amazing. I'm so glad you came here to join me today.

Speaker 2: 45:46

Thank you so much, Me too this was so fun.

Speaker 1: 45:48

We'll have to do this again for sure, maybe you can pick a new topic at Special Needs Moms, there's only a million of them, that's true, that's true, so I'd love to have you back again. That'd be so fun. Yes, so thank you so much, of course. Thank you everyone for joining us and watching today. We